REPLAY #2: Smif-N-Wessun ‘Dah Shinin’’ vs DJ Quik ‘Safe + Sound’ (1995)

Oh yeah, replay, replay. Let's not take the piss.

Here, replay, replay. I will love it if we beat them.

Love it. Hello and welcome to Hip Hop

World Cup, the podcast that pits golden age hip hop tracks and

albums against each other in a contest to find the ultimate

champions. I'm your host, Annie Phillips,

and you're listening to Hip Hop World Cup Replay, a highlight

show looking back at the best matches from our first series.

It's a bit like Match of the Day, if Match of the Day only

showed highlights of one match that took place a few years ago.

Anyway, the reason we're putting these replay episodes out is

that in our first series, we crammed 8 whole albums into each

episode. That's a lot of discussion about

hip hop, so we thought it would be a good idea to single out and

revisit some of the individual battles from that first series.

I'm back here in Zurich sorting out a few more affairs related

to our lease on the FIFA headquarters in Zurich.

We had a custom made bunker that we were using for our first

series. Sadly we we are no longer

allowed to use that. So I'm just back at sorting out

some of the paperwork and I'm catching up with my old mate Sep

who's still here, sort of doing the rounds, walking the

corridors. We're about to revisit a match

from our 1995 episode between Smith and Wesson's to Shining

and DJ Quick, safe and sound. While I was here I nabbed my old

mate Sep Blatter to come in, sit down and provide his thoughts

and analysis on this epic battle.

Hi Sep Hello, great to have you here now.

So, so Seb's going to be providing some insightful

analysis of this match between Smith and Wesson and DJ Quick.

He's also going to be sharing some thoughts about his time as

FIFA president. So please stay tuned for that.

If you want to hear that, by the way, hit the red button on your

podcast app. You'll be able to hear that

alongside our our analysis and discussion of these albums.

But either way, sit back, relax, enjoy this match for our 1995

episode Peace. So next out of the hats.

Thanks, Jeff. It's The Shining by Smith and

Wesson. OK, we're going up against safe

plus sound DJ Quick. Yeah, this is the worst I

haven't realised. I'm glad.

I'm glad It's kind of falling like this.

I think actually, no, I'm not. No.

So you say Smith and Wesson. Yes, Smith and Wesson and safe.

And sound. This is the.

This is This is the. I wanted to see this as the

final, but this would have been a good final anyway.

Right. OK, so.

Round one match 3. It's me first on this one, so DJ

Quick and Smith and Wesson. OK, this is my absolute worst

nightmare come true. I absolutely adore most of these

albums. You've got a classic on the West

Coast versus East Coast match up.

Again, both great examples of the East Coast and the West

Coast sounds. We're going to start with DJ

Quick. Bought this in Binary Star in

Exeter 95. I've got a really weird copy of

it. It's got a back cover that's got

no more information on it. It's just a picture.

It's really weird. Anyway, yeah, love this album.

What I would say the thing that strikes me most about this album

and always has done is how musical it is.

Like DJ Crick is a very musical producer, hip hop producer, like

he really has. He's almost like a jazz sort of

RB producer. He's very, very talented.

His stuff just has an instant kind of real richness and

quality to it. And I think he's described his

own sound as being very pretty, which is I think it's really

good, good sound, he says. So often people find his stuff

too pretty, which I think is a really good.

Driving it I. Reckon as a producer he's as

good as Dre, but I think his stuff's a little bit more

nuanced and a bit more I think it's more sophisticated than not

Dre stuff. I think it's there's more to it,

but ultimately I think Dre has a better sense of, you know,

bangers. What makes a proper kind of hip

hop track or DJ Quicks a little bit more nuanced and jazz

orientated, let's say? This.

Album for me is always my favourite DJ quick album.

It's it's amazing from start to finish.

I don't think as many week tracks, a couple of week tracks

or you know, some of the some of the sex tracks are a bit bit

hard work, but but I think generally it's a really, really

strong. I think it's one of the best

West Coast albums ever made. I think he was associated with

death row around this time and it's on profile, but he started

to just dip into the death row thing.

It's got dollars and cents on it, which was on the Murder Was

The Case soundtrack stand out tracks I think.

Well, as I said, they're all good for me.

Something for the mood. Is is my absolute favourite of

this. This album, I just think it's

brilliant. It's really long, it's got

flutes, it's got all sorts of synths in it.

It's just a really, really great example of musicianship.

Get at Me, the first track I believe it's just comes in

really strong and I love how he's just kind of dissing all

his old sort of camp mates. I think it's, I think it's named

AMG. Get at me.

I think he's having to get at AMG.

I think AMD G did something bad. Really.

Yeah, I think I. Think so, yeah.

I think borrowed something off him and didn't get it back.

So he's really quite a rap about it, but.

He does reference AMG elsewhere in the album, like in a

Positive. Yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm confused

because. He, I think he's on it.

Bitch better have my. Money and run and stuff like

that. I think he's done to go with

somebody, but I don't. I don't I'm.

Not 100% sure, I should probably should have looked into the back

story of that of that before we did this.

But as a track it's amazing. It's got that cameo sample on

it. I think it's Rigour Mortis.

It's such a great opening to an album, but it really gets you

going. And from that it just, I don't

think you know, it's just a complete ride through to the end

of the album. So many great traps on it.

I also love Summer Breeze as well.

I just I always love that one. Let them have it this.

It's a really, really, really good album from start to finish.

I just, I can't really fault it. Moving on to Smith.

And Wesson, I think, again, this is if I had to drop the top ten

albums of all time, it's in there.

So we're dealing with two of my favourite albums of all time.

This again, if those aliens came down and said to you, look, you

know, we've heard a bit about these beat miners, you know,

give us an album to take away that represents their sound.

I'd hand them a copy of this and say, look, this is the this is

the beat minus this is this is what they do.

Again, it's very much for those jazz samples, the filtered

baselines, but there's a real raw kind of dirtiness to their

sound that really, really works. But it's just it's just

something something about the way Smith and Wesson, they kind

of flow on the beat and it just suits that beat miners style

really well. Really gritty, really raw.

The flow, the interplay between them isn't it is amazing.

In terms of stand out tracks. I think Hallucination is one of

my all time favourite hip hop tracks.

Love that, love the mini Rippity sample and I just love the story

they tell in it, sort of the beat.

I mean, I think they must use that.

What notes? Why can't people be colours to

break about in on every single track on this album?

They know their drums and they've got certain drums they

love. So sometimes it did not be say

me, but you know, I just I love I love their production style.

I love the beats they use all of these samples they choose.

It's got a bit of Black Moon on it, very jazzy.

And then and it rounds out the album with PNC parts and Crime,

which has a like a one way sample on it.

And I love that track. I mean, I love the original, but

the way they used that sample was just incredible.

So for me, this is going to be a really, really, really difficult

decision. And I hate you, Steve and Jeff

for pulling this these two out the hat against each other

because what means one of them's got to go home, one of them one

of them's on the plane early. I don't like that at all.

So I'm. Going to.

Sit and Mull over it for a bit while I listen to both of you.

But we'll have we'll have Steve next on this one.

Yeah, I think I feel the same. Same to you, Danny.

This is another great matchup. But we know this is we this

World Cup is going to be just a bloodbath, really.

It's it's so hard to choose between some of these albums.

And like I said, East Coast versus West Coast, the DJ Quick

album, it's I don't know you, I think you 2 are much, much more

familiar with that kind of the technical side of, of things.

And, but I, I don't know, I kind of even even I could spot like

all the kind of great samples that he, he, he used.

And so that kind of like makes it really kind of enjoyable to

listen to. It's it's really quite funky and

there's so many good tracks on there and and you know, two or

three classic tracks as well. It does, I think Peter out a

little bit towards the end. And again, it's probably not one

that you're going to want to play with your wife in the room.

And he he definitely loves himself, doesn't he?

I mean, crikey. And it gets a little bit

annoying how much he kind of goes.

On about Wouldn't you though, if you were that good at doing

doing music? Yeah, but I think I'd have

enough self esteem not to kind of like put it all over the

records all the time. I mean, I don't know.

So yeah, but great album. Definitely his best album, the

Smith and Wesson album. It's just, it's just it's just

got such a great sound. And I think both of you probably

know like this is this is definitely right right up my

kind of Ave in terms of what I love that kind of more rough and

rugged sound. But I guess also kind of similar

to DJ quick, some amazing choice of samples as well.

I definitely don't think there's a bad track of this album.

And Danny, it's really interesting to hear you say that

you put this in your top ten albums of all time.

I think I probably I probably underrated this album.

I think this is this is the the whole of this World Cup.

It's been the one album I've come back to and thought, you

know, more than Big Out what an amazing album this is.

And those two classic tracks, Hallucination and PAPNCI, just

think I just on another level. But yeah, like so many of the

good tracks on there recognise Sam Boy, Burial, Bucktown.

The Bucktown is amazing as well, isn't it?

You've got, yeah, you've got, you've got.

Keep it moving bucktail, and stand strong.

Stand strong. And the.

Ones on the side of that brilliant as well.

So like, but then you get into that one of three, it's like.

Home Sweet Homes. Good.

Let's get it on. It's just it's just a cracking

album. So yeah, but that.

But because they're almost like kind of like opposite, they're

opposite coast opposite sounds. It's really hard to choose.

It is really hard to choose between them.

So yeah, I'm going to have a bit of time to know that overwhelm.

Well, Larry, Larry tells us what he thinks.

Yeah, I think, yeah, I'm surprised actually, Steve, but

you are not surprised. But I didn't think that you were

so as into like the quick album as me.

And you're probably not into it as much as me and Danny.

But it's nice to hear that you do really like it.

Yeah, I don't think I've realised how much I liked it.

So it's like gave another kind of listen and it was like, yeah,

one of those ones that I'd not that I slept on anything like

that, but I just forgotten that I liked it.

Yeah, I kind of I, I'd like, I'd be interested to know sort of

how it's regarded in the wider world because in my mind, I

always kind of think that maybe like me and Danny absolutely

love this album, but we're like somehow maybe the only people

that really rate it. I never really hit see people

talking about it. No I don't.

I think it's a slept on album. Yeah.

I mean, I've never seen much sort of love for us, it being

celebrated in that way. Yeah, So it isn't it.

But with both these albums, I was listening to what you said,

Danny, and we're just thinking like the exact same things that

I've got written down that I think I'll start with Smith and

Wesson. And for me, this is like the

obvious kind of pairing for this would have been Mobb Deep.

Like they're really, really similar albums as I kind of

mentioned earlier, but for me, and I've always loved this one,

it's a really cohesive sounding album.

Like thanks, thanks. The beat miners.

I think a lot of the kind of best albums ever in whatever

genre are so good because that the songs will kind of tune from

the same material. And that's like really the case

here. I just kind of like the temp

that the sort of template of their sound like the

atmospheric, dry, dusty, hazy kind of soundscape like when I

first started making hip hop, like this was my template for

doing it. This is what I was trying to

kind of mimic and it didn't really occur to me before today

actually, but that track that I sent you both the other day,

like that is this album like all over it.

Like it's just shows how deep in my kind of subconscious it is

that I just make tracks that emulate it without even kind of

thinking about it. So yeah, I mean, in terms of

standout attracts me, like let's get it on.

It's got probably my favourite sample ever, like that Mandrill

sample. I love the kind of the track

that it samples. After the Races is really great,

the interplay between tech and steel is like is so incredible.

I think kind of this album is probably my favourite ever

example of two rappers like integrating in that way I think.

Not that I'm like the biggest like run DMC fan or know their

albums well, but I'd say they're the only kind of duos that

really match up like that kind of level of interplay.

Maybe they're a bit better than Smith and Mercer.

Smith, Mercer, they're just absolutely great with it.

There are no weak tracks on the album whatsoever.

I think Home Sweet Home is probably my least favourite

track and I don't think it's a particularly inventive way of

kind of using that Royer's sample.

It's been done much better so that the only three out of five

for me, but there are loads of fives and four out of fives

entire of of listening to really.

I'm starting to. Think we might know which album

has got the? Unprecedented 4.75 was it?

Maybe, maybe. But we'll, I'll say save that

information for for later on, I think, but.

Not this one, no. They would need, they would need

both. They would need both fives.

Yeah, maybe it's it's got fives. It's got fives on it.

Definitely like keep it moving. It's absolutely love.

But again, it's just sort of my my template really.

And it's it samples Paul McCartney drums, which you don't

hear very often in in hip hop. Mother, Miss America.

Mother Miss America also used on Common.

This is me, I think, yeah, probably some other stuff.

So yeah, absolutely love that album.

And yeah, it pains me to have to put it up against DJ Quick

because that's another album I'm just absolutely in love with.

I actually, like, bizarrely, I found it quite difficult to

probably gather my thoughts on DJ Quick because like, there

aren't any standout tracks on the album.

They're just all, they're all good.

There's like the only kind of bit that really dips for me is

like, as alluded to early, like let me eat it and can I eat it

just a bit, kind of too embarrassing juvenile to listen

to even by yourself. And actually, and can I eat it?

It's probably the weakest beat on the album as well.

Yeah, but with that kind of with that negative kind of side out

the way, I think I'll probably go as far as to say it's, I

think it's like musically the Best Hip Hop album ever.

A bold statement. It's bold, yeah.

I think it's like you said, it's like you said, it's more the

sort of R&B kind of jazzy thing I've put here that it's more of

a kind of soulful funk album basically.

Like there's no boom back to it whatsoever.

Like the complete opposite of most of the other albums here.

Especially like comparing it, you know, to shine like we are

here. But yeah, it's just on another

level musically, like the musicians.

It must have been like a really expensive album to make, I

think. I think like I don't know if I

haven't got the line notes myself but like Wikipedia says

that it's got like 3 bass players.

On there which? Kind of says it all, like the

bass work on this, like it's just impeccable throughout.

It's got Rock Box the Bacon on guitar.

Yeah, just just incredible. It's kind of like that Doctor

Dre method of like working with musicians taken to its logical

conclusion, really. And you know, as much as I love

Sheree, I just don't think, like you said, I don't think he's

made an album as musically good as this before we even know he's

kind of a more important producer to hip hop.

I think, you know, Quick is just that such an unsung hero of the

West Coast, and this is the best thing he ever did.

Like both of you have said, it's just all the little details in

there, just like listening to it critically to them on a good

pair of headphones, really kind of listening out.

And there are things like that, things I heard today that I've

genuinely never heard before. And I sort of thought I knew the

album inside out, but it's just so layered.

Yeah. And.

There's little things just like the.

Scratching that, it doesn't it And there's the little films and

things like that and. Yeah.

The way it's all stitched together.

And they go in. For one to the next.

And it just flows so well. It's just like, it's more like a

kind of like a Parliament album or something like that.

Obviously really heavily influenced by Parliament, kind

of similar kind of acts. But he's also got a really good

voice. I think I've always loved by

ever since. Like the first tracker I heard

of his was tonight, which I heard on the old Pete Tong radio

show. And I loved him, but like since

there you are bit of an easy kind of sound, his voice sort of

names high pitched, high pitched.

But yeah, great rapper. Like really good lyrical

content. But the whole album is just so

summary. As well, it's a very.

Secure summer album like Quick Screw being an obvious one and

something to the mood as well. You've also got like the digs at

MC8, which are kind of just some of the best disc tracks since

like the whole Ruth first death row by episode.

Yeah, like 2 like to have two solid tracks in a row.

Like there wasn't sense in that You have it both just A and

squarely and CA just completely audacious.

Yeah, one of the best diss tracks of all times, yeah.

Yeah, amazing. I just never thought of

listening to the album. I didn't really kind of realise

quite how much I loved it before kind of sitting down today to to

kind of review it basically. And and it is the 4.75 out of

five. OK.

So it's that one, yeah. Every like there's like there's

like just pretty much everything is a fine.

OK, well, that's this is strong. This is strong.

The only only pits like digging you out 4.5 it's your fantasy

4.5 tangre for the rest of it I just it's just perfect.

Like with the way kind of St level comes back at the end with

like hurrah for the funk instrumental of that, but with

the kind of additional instruments at the end.

It's just just love it so much. It's great.

All right. Well, let's so we move this

along then, lads, Let's just see what let's do our vote.

Let's let's put it to the I think it's pretty clear what

you're going to go for, Larry. I think I think where where I'm

going to go with this and I'm going to consult real rank on

this, whereas I totally agree with you, Larry.

I think DJ Quick is a really, really strong album, Like almost

Perfect in terms of, you know, that West Coast, that musicality

I. I just.

I just think that Smith and Wesson I.

I think it's a. Bit of hip hop album I think

it's. It meant more.

To me back then, I think, and I just, there are more replay, but

I used to replay those tracks more than I did DJ Quick, even

though I love both of these albums.

Yeah. So yeah, I think Smith and

Wesson's going to get my vote on this one.

OK, I have that at the top of my.

Ranking system. So, yeah, that that's my vote.

So that's that's that's one for Smith and Wesson.

Go on, Larry, you. You go and I do the costume on,

I think. Just go, you know, you can.

You heard how in kind of, you know, enthusiastical was about

this and it yeah, it is DJ Quick.

But it really pains me to not vote for Smith and Wesson.

Like there are not many albums that would beat out Smith and

Wesson for me and. Yeah.

It's it's a shocker. It is like definitely one of my

favourites. It's definitely a favourite New

York album, really influential on kind of what I do.

But yeah, quick, it's just got too many good.

It's just it's a feel good album, but Smith and Wesson

isn't really. And that's I think why I kind of

favourite. Yeah, interesting take on that.

Yeah. I mean, it's, I mean, it's such

a difficult choice for me, but this is huge now.

Because we've got. It comes down to Steve's vote on

this one. This is like, you know, Brazil,

Germany in in in the World Cup finals a bit a big guns going to

have to go out a. Big gun is going to have to go,

and that's the beauty of World Cup hip hop, isn't it?

So I keep saying so did. Absolutely.

So. For for me and just, you know,

the only way I can decide this I think is my personal taste.

They're two really great albums, really enjoyable, both of them.

But my personal tastes are more with Smith and Wesson.

I think I prefer the sound of the album.

I think I prefer the tracks and I think there's more classic

tracks on there. So I'm, I'm sorry, Larry, The

Shining is is is going to it's going to score a goal here and

they're going to go through. Yeah, I don't.

Really. I don't, I can't really feel bad

about it. Like I, I love this album as

well. So, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, I mean, it was another high.

Scorer for me. It's brutal.

Absolutely brutal. It's really sad to see DJ Quick

go, but you know, someone had to.

This is almost like one of those sort of went out on penalties.

It was nil, nil all the way through.

Like a war of I think, I think. I think if you put it to a

public vote, 100 random hip hop fans of our work, kind of, you

know, vintage, I think Smith and Wesson probably go through.

Yeah, yeah, they're not going. To be tearing up the the seats

and stuff and rampaging down you.

Know down. The Street.

So this this verdict, I think it's the right outcome.

But one, you know, it's a sad that one of my favourite albums

from this year is to go out at such an early stage.

That's it. I hope you enjoyed that epic

battle. Let us know what you think on X

Instagram threads and blue sky. Just search at hip hop World

Cup. Give us a follow and let us know

you're listening. Also, please subscribe and leave

us nice five star reviews on Spotify, Apple or your podcast

platform of choice. We also have a YouTube channel,

so please check us out on there. But that's it.

Thanks for listening and we'll see you for our next replay.

Peace good. Looking.